MapTool 1.2 Development Release Build 5

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thelevitator
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Post by thelevitator »

I was posting at the same time as Dorpond, so excuse the consecutive posts. I think Dorpond has an excellent idea! I would predominately use one method all the time and it would save a lot of time if it were the same way every time and I could just change it on the rare times that I would need another way to show vision. :D
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SDShannonS
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Post by SDShannonS »

I was a little confused about the Visible Area Only at first too until I read through this thread and then suddenly realized... that's exactly what I've been asking for.

It's the Expose tool for GMs who want their players to feel as if they are constantly surrounded by darkness which is only being pushed back by the feeble light of their flickering little torches. If you don't want your players to have a complete map of everywhere they've ever been or to see at a glance that there MUST be a secret room between Room X and Hall Y because of the spacing, then this is the tool for you.

As Phergus said, if they want a map for themselves, then they can draw the darned thing. For me, MapTool is an aid not a crutch.

I also agree with Dorpond's note that it needs to take into account all tokens that have a Vision enabled. Exposing one token's Vision should not plunge the rest of the tokens into utter darkness.


Shannon

P.S. The Poly-line tool works like a charm, Trevor! Thanks so very much! I will probably be using it exclusively rather than the hollow rectangle because, although it is a bit slower, it makes placement of doors and other openings much easier. Erasing sections always leaves badly formed ends which then have to be repaired so I'd rather just do the walls properly the first time with the poly-line tool.

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stefam
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Post by stefam »

Hi All,

I'm training my new assistant DM on Maptool and we both agree that we'd like the vision selection to be "toggleable". Finally, players will have the feeling of dread after going for four hours into a dungeon, only to have one of them say "Anyone remember how to get outta here???" or "Haven't we been here already?"

I agree with the above posts that All light sources need to be visible. I'll be using light sources for objects such as torches and eerie glowing evil things. Also, if the party spreads out their light sources, they should get a benefit.

We both love the poly-line tool! XLNT!
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dorpond
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Post by dorpond »

I slept on it and I came to a realization that we definately need a Reveal Area and Reveal Path in the token menu. At first I thought we only needed one in the token menu and we decided which method we used in the global settings however there are times where we need to move tokens from one area of the map to the other to setup game/scene. In that case having just one global Reveal would ruin our map if our global setting was Reveal Path so we definately need both Reveal Area AND Reveal Path in the token menu.

The way I see it is this. I too would like the third new reveal option from time to time especially during horror campaigns. If we plan on having other methods of Reveal in the future - we should put them in the global settings. If we are not going to have anymore reveal methods, make them all non-destructive so if we switch between them, they all revert to the other and "remember" where we have been.

As far as Phergus's comment that they should be using graph paper and be mapping it out - that is another gaming style and that is cool; I just don't want that gaming style ruining my gaming style because I accidentally clicked the wrong reveal option by accident. It is far too destructive currently to the other gaming methods.

So in a nutshell -I like all three methods - I just think we can tweak the switching of them a bit better.

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trevor
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Post by trevor »

I think quick keys will help that because for the most common one you use, you will know that key stroke, when you need a different one you can look it up in the menu.

I think some of the primary confusion is the naming. What should we call the third option instead of the current name ?
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Post by Phergus »

The vision setting that keeps any previously revealed areas probably should be called Persistent Reveal or something similar that indicates by name what it actually does.

The other could be Token Area Only Reveal but that is really unwieldy. Local Reveal maybe.

The Reveal Path is a variation of Persistent Reveal and is probably good enough as is. The name indicates it will reveal a larger area and not just the area immediately around the token.

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dLANbandit
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Post by dLANbandit »

how about .

Reveal

and

Reveal & Hide

dorpond
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Post by dorpond »

dLANbandit wrote:how about .

Reveal

and

Reveal & Hide
I like simple names like this and the hide really makes it clear.

Although I would still hate to hit it by accident :)

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dLANbandit
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Post by dLANbandit »

I agree with you D. I think it should be "Update Vision", and their should be a setting in preferences that changes if it is reveal or reveal and hide.

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Post by SDShannonS »

Dorpond, I can definitely see your point that one slip of the mouse could ruin one's whole day until we have the ability to Undo FoW reveals.

What if the two Expose options were put in areas of the menu tree that are plenty removed from each other? Like on opposite ends of a list of options or perhaps in separate sub-menus. Do you think that would address your main worry?

[EDIT: Actually, they're already at opposite ends of the menu, but Visible Area Only is still right next to Last Path. What about a big honkin' separator between the two menu options to reduce the likelihood of accidentally clicking a smidge too low and hitting the wrong one?]


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trevor
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Post by trevor »

Undo should lessen the blow of hitting the wrong one
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drswoboda
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Post by drswoboda »

trevor wrote:Undo should lessen the blow of hitting the wrong one
As well as save/load. . .

Though I understand Dorpond's concern.

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trevor
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Post by trevor »

SDShannonS wrote:if I have one token that generates vision out to 60 feet or so, performance is speedy and responsive. If I change that token to 120 feet or if I add a second token with 60 feet of vision, performance takes a significant hit.
I've put in another optimization for 1.2b6 that caches the vision calculations until the toplogy changes or the token moves.
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Azhrei
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Post by Azhrei »

Trevor,

Would it work to have a small dialog box (a movable box via the flexdock system) that contains the various exposure options with a "Preview" and "Apply" button?

The GM would bring up this window and place it on the screen. The typical "Reveal" or "Reveal & Hide" option would be selected as per the defaults stored in Preferences. But if the GM changes the value (a radiobutton or listbox, probably, depending on how many options there are), then the buttons are enabled. Clicking Preview would show what would happen if all areas on the map were to use the new "Reveal" mode and Apply would make it permanent (at least, until the FoW Undo were available).

If the Preview/Apply buttons were not used, then the current "Reveal" mode would only be applied to newly exposed areas and not to existing areas of the map.

Is that workable? Dorpond, what do you think?

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trevor
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Post by trevor »

In fact we've thought about doing this same thing for all drawables/fog/whatever
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