Upgraded to MT 1.4.0.5 w/ BoT v40c and having token problems

[Oryan77]

I tend to have tokens on the map that are identically named but are located in different areas. So room 1a might have tokens named "Zombie 1" and "Zombie 2". Room 2a might also have tokens "Zombie 1" and "Zombie 2". I have been using MT for many years now. I have always done this for reasons that I don't feel the need to explain and I have never had issues with it before.

I know there are some features of MT that does not like tokens with the same name to be on the same map. For how I use MT though and the features that I use, this has never been an issue and it has always worked just fine for me.

Last night, we begin playing for the first time after I upgraded to MT v1.4.0.5 along with Wolph42's BoT v40c. As I am starting to move NPC tokens around during a combat, my players tell me that other NPC tokens are missing from the map (we play at my house using a TV as a VTT with my laptop as the DM server and another laptop as the player side). Then I notice that as I am moving a token, it is leaving a copy of a token in its place. After testing it, I realize that when I am moving "Zombie 1", MT is grabbing another "Zombie 1" from another room and putting that token in the square where the first "Zombie 1" was before I moved it.

I asked last week about what alphanumeric characters we can use (now) because I found out after upgrading MT and BoT that using the new MT/BoT is going to require that I once again rename 3000 tokens (not including the tokens I already have placed on all of my maps) because the characters I changed many years ago are no longer supported in newer features. I was told back then to rename my tokens from using a "-" to using a ";" instead and it would be fine, which it was until I just upgraded. Now I'm told I can use a ":" instead of a ";" and I need to rename all of my tokens again. Now I am concerned that I can't even have tokens with the same name on a map if I wanted to.

I'm a big supporter of MT and I have turned many gamers on to using it. I'm also very patient and understanding about issues like this and I appreciate the work you guys do. So I don't want to come off as I am simply complaining here. But I have to admit that as a user, this token naming issue is finally beating me down and I absolutely don't understand why at this day and age it is even an issue at all.

Restricting users to how they name tokens seems completely user unfriendly. I work with many programmers in my field as a graphic artist and this seems like another situation where the engineers are more concerned with what is convenient for them to do with the software rather than how that affects the users. The names on a token really should not have any bearing whatsoever on the functionality side of the program. It's just a name. I know it was explained in my last thread about alphanumeric characters, but figuring out how to save the users from dealing with so much unnecessary trouble in regards to something as basic as what we want to name a token seems way more important than continuing to use a token name rather than a token ID as the identifier for programming functions.

At least having a restriction in place so that players can't even name a token in a way that causes conflicts would be helpful. Although I still don't see that as a solution. Being told that we can't name a fantasy character token "Tar-lok" in a game that is mostly used for playing with fantasy characters is definitely not appealing to me. I say this with all due respect, we really need a solution to this that is not simply a band-aid fix. Users should not be restricted to something as simple and basic as a token character name. Time is precious at my age and I just can't keep changing thousands of token names because I didn't realize there would be problems with my naming conventions years later.

Perhaps my problem with MT last night was due to some other issue and not because of the tokens I had on my map. Maybe it is a BoT issue and not a MT issue? Please let me know if I need to provide any other information about this. I am glad to help test things. Anything I can do to help I will. Thanks guys.

[wolph42]

this is a problem that will be solved in a future version of mt. when we move from data holding tokens to just 'placeholders'. This will solve most problems. Not helping at the moment though.
Another issue is that currently we can't use token IDs as Identifier in the code but have to use names. The latter causes all kinds of issues if you have two identically named tokens as a macro simply does not know which 'zombie 1' you are referring at. This too will be solved in a future version. But not currently.

Now the bot uses some pretty advanced stuff AND its activated everytime you move a token. You can turn off the ontokenmove event on the BoT macros (theres a button for that). This will solve most problems.

Another thing is that if you get a list of e.g. selected tokens that these will be in a list that is either , separated or ; separated. Hence you can imagine what happens if you name a token: 'Zombie,Ork'. Also lists are stored as "stuff,stuff,stuff" or 'stuf,stuff,stuff' so again using " or ' will bork stuff.

Another thing is that in the code : plays a crucial role so again this might screw things up. Again this will be solved as soon as we can use ID instead of name.

For now though you are limited to mostly alphanumerical names with the safest separators being space and underscore. Other character could not cause an issue but is entirely depend on the macros you use.

For this reason I build the 'diagnose' button (you can run it light) and a rename macro to swiftly rename all 'wrongly names' tokens. Beyond that you either have to wait for future releases or don't use too fancy macros.

hth.

[Oryan77]

Before I start spending the time fixing my tokens so they work, what do you suggest I do at the moment to be able to use my maps like I always have been as far as having tokens with the same name on the map ("Zombie 1" and "Zombie 1" on another part of the map)?

Is the problem I had last night with that issue a result of the latest BoT? Do you mean that by turning off the ontokenmove event, it will fix my issue? I use quite a few BoT features and I am not sure what turning that event off will do exactly.

I had already changed the alphanumeric characters the other day in response to my last thread about that. I am hoping I do not now need to go back to all of those same tokens and change their names again so there are no duplicate names on the map.

Thanks for the response Wolph42!

[wolph42]

I think that if you turn off the restore vbl after move toggle that you don't have this issue anymore. If it's off already than I initially suggest to turn off the entire ontokenmove to see if that's the actual problem.
Overall its hard to tell what is causing the problem, but the vbl restore toggle certainly will influence it as it negates move, checks vbl and then moves the token (by name).

[Oryan77]

It looks like the issue of tokens with identical names having issues was due to the 'VBL move check' toggle in the BoT. Turning that off like you suggested seems to allow me to continue using identically named tokens as I normally have.

I upgraded to the new MT and BoT at the same time. So I wasn't sure which was causing me this issue. Thanks for identifying that issue for me.

I have a player that is notoriously bad about moving his token right over/through VBL lines and revealing sections of the map by accident. So that toggle was one of the features I activated when I upgraded the BoT. That sucks, because that is a convenient feature to use but I would rather not rename all of my tokens again at the moment.

Thanks.

I think using IDs as Identifiers in the code is the one feature I feel is most needed and I look forward to seeing implemented the most. I'd much rather have user friendly usability than more neat MT features. The amount of hours I've wasted renaming tokens and rptok files due to this single issue is insane. As a MT user that is not familiar with programming and alphanumeric restrictions, this sort of issue is something that I seem to keep finding out the hard way.