Announcement: MapTool 1.5.1 Released

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Full Bleed
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Re: Announcement: MapTool 1.5.1 Released

Post by Full Bleed »

taustinoc wrote:
Wed Mar 27, 2019 2:23 am
Full Bleed wrote:
Wed Mar 27, 2019 2:08 am
Unfortunately, I rolled back my primary test system (with my initial issue) a week after I couldn't generate an External Address via "Connection Information" inside MT... thinking I might have broken something with all this "testing". Turns out MT needs the RPTools Registry for that? Ugh. Can't MT pull that locally? Kind of a double whammy when people who can't start an alias server have to use a direct connection method that requires them to get their IP from some other source/method. I always use direct connection, but for those that don't it's an extra step to hunt down their IP for an unfamiliar process.
If you're behind a router (and nearly everyone is), the only practical way to find out your public IP address is to connect to somewhere else and as "what's my IP address?" The best way to do that is to control where you connect to. That's how MapTool is set up. There are other ways to do it, but none that are practical.
Understood. Anyway to have MT poll one of those other sites if it throws an "Unknown" result?
Maptool is the Millennium Falcon of VTT's -- "She may not look like much, but she's got it where it counts."

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Re: Announcement: MapTool 1.5.1 Released

Post by Full Bleed »

Azhrei wrote:
Tue Mar 26, 2019 7:17 pm
Phergus' point is well-taken in that a broken Java installation could be causing other problems (and likely is). You have to remember that Windows is pretty stupid about DLLs. If you've got JAVA.DLL in directory A and another one in directory B, whichever one is listed first in PATH will be picked up if an application requests it. So an application (like MT) that is in directory B could pick up the (broken) DLL in directory A.
Well, going on the supposition that there is some kind of broken java install or hidden path to something broken I went into my window's environmental path and added the path to the MT's runtime/bin directory... and, finally, I was able to open the MT EXE install. If I take the path out it stops working again.

Not sure if that's useful information or not or if something can be done to add/remove an environmental path on un/installs to address this corner case... but that seems to be my solution.

Thanks for the ideas and info.


And I also figured out the "Result of executing 'java -version':" error flag in the GDB. Even with a "proper" uninstall of Java and a registry clean it sometimes leaves a left over environmental path that doesn't affect MT's ability to load and function normally. This was happening on two of the systems I was testing (and at various points in testing a 3rd computer.) MT was installing fine and working... but still throwing the error in the GDB. Scrub the Environmental Variable list (after all Java installs are removed) and you get the pop-up error that indicates there is no java install.

It seems highly dependent what java versions you've installed. Java 10, for example, seems pretty good about cleaning out its path from the environmental variables in windows, but I've found some other java versions aren't so good about it. Fortunately, so far as I can tell, MT runs fine even with a bad path in the windows environmental variables noted in the GDB... and with the update to the GDB in 1.5.2 no one will know they have any leftover "bad" paths moving forward anyway.
Maptool is the Millennium Falcon of VTT's -- "She may not look like much, but she's got it where it counts."

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Re: Announcement: MapTool 1.5.1 Released

Post by Azhrei »

Full Bleed wrote:
Wed Mar 27, 2019 7:41 am
Well, going on the supposition that there is some kind of broken java install or hidden path to something broken I went into my window's environmental path and added the path to the MT's runtime/bin directory... and, finally, I was able to open the MT EXE install. If I take the path out it stops working again.
Cool. Yes, it means one of the directories in your PATH contains remnants of a previous Java install and Windows is finding it before it finds the JRE packaged with MT.
Not sure if that's useful information or not or if something can be done to add/remove an environmental path on un/installs to address this corner case... but that seems to be my solution.
No, it’s not really useful. Phergus was right that you had leftover garbage somewhere. Your “solution” puts a bandaid on it, but you haven’t cleaned the wound or stitched it up, so it’s likely to bleed further in the future.
Thanks for the ideas and info.
You’re welcome. We’re always happy to try to help. But I think you know that — you’ve been here long enough!

It does get frustrating sometimes, both for the user who thinks they’ve done everything they can, and for the person who’s trying to help who knows that they haven’t! :roll:

That Process Monitor tool will help you find the damaged directory in your PATH (you’ll have to revert your change, of course). There are other tools, like Dependency Walker, which are static and only look at the exe and I don’t think that would help. Good luck!

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Re: Announcement: MapTool 1.5.1 Released

Post by Full Bleed »

Azhrei wrote:
Wed Mar 27, 2019 8:42 am
It does get frustrating sometimes, both for the user who thinks they’ve done everything they can, and for the person who’s trying to help who knows that they haven’t! :roll:
Well, to be fair, it wasn't that I thought I'd "done everything" it was that I'd done everything early suggestions indicated (and more)... the low hanging fruit wasn't the issue... I was looking for advice from the guys with ladders. ;)

One of the "frustrating" parts is when results don't meet the expectations that the advice givers give and there appears to be an impression that the user is doing something else horribly wrong to make that happen. Or that they're providing inaccurate data... which I understand happens (and is generally expected by those in the know)...

But, often, there are observations and understandings of what's going on that aren't quite accurate on both sides. When I say, "MT appears to be using some Java outside its install" I'm told... nope, not possible. And maybe I didn't phrase it "just right"... But, actually, that's exactly what seems to be happening. Whether it's Windows fault, or Oracles bad uninstalls over the past 10 years, or the fact that I've probably dragged this particular install through an XP to 7 to 8 to 10 upgrade path... :shock: some java garbage somewhere else on my computer is getting first dibs over MT's supposedly self-contained, independent, Java installation. Instruct the OS to look at MT first and it works. But without that instruction it fails. So, from my perspective, it's not quite as walled off as I thought... and if you say that it can't be, then I guess that's just the way it goes and a nurse has to attempt surgery to fix the issue using plumbing tools. :p

That Process Monitor tool will help you find the damaged directory in your PATH (you’ll have to revert your change, of course). There are other tools, like Dependency Walker, which are static and only look at the exe and I don’t think that would help. Good luck!
Kind of excited to find out where the garbage is... I found an entire jre directory nested inside an old Acrobat 9 Pro (2008) dependency (Designer 8.2) in my cleaning efforts... I was hopeful that was the problem... but it wasn't. Hopefully Process monitor will get the job done.
Maptool is the Millennium Falcon of VTT's -- "She may not look like much, but she's got it where it counts."

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