Complex roll formula for simple mechanic?

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thelevitator
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Complex roll formula for simple mechanic?

Post by thelevitator »

Ok, so I've got the ability to make FUDGE rolls in MT, and I created token properties. I can create token macros to make attacks for tokens, using the token properties. That all works wonderfully.

Now here is my problem. FUDGE uses the same roll to calculate both the "to hit" and the "damage". So, I don't see a way to use a single roll to calculate 2 different properties. Of course, this is alleviated by just making a 2nd damage roll, and MT handles that beautifully for FUDGE mechanics. But I really prefer the simpler mechanic of determining both the Combat Skill (attack) and ODF (Offensive Damage Factor, or just Damage) with the same roll.

Is there a way to create a macro that generates two different totals (due to both totals using different modifiers) with the same dice roll?
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Post by wrathchild »

Not before we get the ability to "save" a roll to a token property - aka. Macro modified Token properties.
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thelevitator
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Post by thelevitator »

Ahh...cool. Thanks wrathchild! :) I guess in the meantime, we'll just use the damage roll option, until that feature is available.
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Post by Craig »

You can use the same dice roll to produce 2 -- or more -- different results based on modifiers.

I know nothing about FUDGE so let me give you an example in some made up system. To keep it simple lets say you roll a d20, and you add your Dex to that for your to hit roll, you add Str for the damage roll.

you could do the following in the token macro.
Die Roll = [val = d20], To Hit = [val + Dex], Damage = [val + Str]
(feel free to call the val variable anything you want but try to keep away from words starting with roll)

That would give you a result something like
JoeBlow: Die Roll = « val = d20 ⇒ val = 15 = 15 », To Hit = « val + Dex ⇒ 15 + 10 = 25 », Damage = « val + Str ⇒ 15 + 5 = 20 »

Just a note though, the variable remains until you quit, so if you have other macros and you forget the bit that sets it ([val = d20]) then you will pick up an old roll.

Is this the kind of thing that you are after?

If this original rolled value is discarded after determining the to hit and damage then I advise this method over using the interim set token properties solution when it is available firstly because it is simpler, secondly updating a property based on a roll, then using that gives you a hidden roll as the updating of tokens from macros doesn't show results -- think of this as a spam prevention measure.

If the rolled value needs to hang around for each player/npc -- it has some effect on other things they may do or something -- then you will have to wait for the ability to update token properties from a macro.

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Post by thelevitator »

That's exactly what I'm looking for!

I just tested this with a very complex macro and it worked PERFECTLY!

THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU!!!!!

If anyone's curious, here's the macro I created with Craig's help:

Code: Select all

<b>Die Roll =</b> [val = 1dF + 1dF + 1dF + 1dF]<br><b> Offensive Weapon Skill = </b>[val + Weapon1 + Weapon1Speed + OffensiveStance + OpponentDefensiveStance + Injuries + Multiple Opponents]<br><b>Defensive Combat Skill = </b>[val + Weapon1 + Weapon1Speed + DefensiveStance + Injuries + MultipleOpponents]<br><b>Damage =</b>[val + ODF1 + Strength + Scale + Injuries]
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thelevitator
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Post by thelevitator »

And now I have a follow-up question; is it possible to create a button that will set individual token properties?

Here's the context. CinEpic uses something called "Stances". Stances are for tactical flavor, and they represent how offensive or defensive a character is for the round. There are 5 Stances:

Berserker = +2 to Offense/-2 to Defense
Aggressive = +1 to Offense/-1 to Defense
Normal = 0 to Offense/0 to Defense
Cautious = -1 to Offense/+1 to Defense
Defensive = -2 to Offense/ +2 to Defense

What I would love to do would be to create buttons for each Stance, so that I can just click on the Stance, and it would change the Token's Offensive Stance and Defensive Stance. Is this possible yet?
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Post by Craig »

[quote="thelevitator"]And now I have a follow-up question; is it possible to create a button that will set individual token properties?

Not at this point in time. It is being worked on though.

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thelevitator
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Post by thelevitator »

Ah...good to know! Thanks again for your help Craig! It's really no problem to enter the Offensive and Defensive Stances with the pop-up windows, since we use a Declare Action phase where all combatants reveal their stances, so they are right in the chat window. Right now I just made text buttons that just state the Stance for each combatant.

This was a huge assist Craig, and I really appreciate it. While the group is leaning toward separate damage rolls, I would really like to keep the mechanics simple and use the single roll. I also want to make my game as user-friendly as possible for those who might not want to use MT to run their games (Gasp....heresy!).
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Post by Craig »

Hmm
If you are happy keeping track manually (as you are at the moment) there is at least a way to save yourself some typing.

You can make macro buttons for the stances that set variables, these variables wont be attached to the token but they can still be used in a token variable.

For example a Berserker stance macro button may be
Switching to Berserker Stance, [stance_off = 2] [stance_def = -2]

You can then use the stance_off and stance_def variables inside your token macros. This will work well for players, as they only have to remember to hit the correct stance macro button when they change stance (the variables are unique to each client, so player1 and player2 can have different values in their stance_off). For the GM its a little more difficult as you need to remember to hit the correct macro button before each NPC's turn.

Its not as good a solution as updating a token property but its still workable.

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thelevitator
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Post by thelevitator »

That works great! Thanks a ton Craig! I'm assuming that the defender's values won't be automated until scripting is added. But that cuts down 2 entries for each roll. The only things that have to be added manually now are the opponent's Stances and the multiple opponent penalty.

This is literally blowing my mind! I had to explain to Jen why I was doing a little dance just now. :oops:
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Craig
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Post by Craig »

thelevitator wrote: I'm assuming that the defender's values won't be automated until scripting is added.


There is no way to do it at the moment and you may have to wait until scripting is added. Even then there will be things that will need to be resolved before you would be able to do it. For example how would you know which token to read the defense property from. I guess you could add a target property to a token and then use that to determine where to fetch the value from, but what about the case where you have multiple targets and you need to resolve an attack against each one.

Hmm there is also the case of which -- if any -- properties would you allow players to get the value from another token in their macros.

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thelevitator
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Post by thelevitator »

The more I think about it, the more I think I may prefer the idea of always having the pop up. In FUDGE, it's very easy to adjudicate bonuses and penalties "on the fly", so pop-ups work really well for that system. I've run several test combats with the current system, and it works really well. FUDGE is very low math, where total numbers rarely hit double digits, except for damage. And considering that 15 points can kill a creature in FUDGE (especially since I'm using the non-linear version of wound tracking), it's extremely easy to do 99% of the math in FUDGE in your head.

It's a different perspective than say, using DM Genie for 3.5. I love DM Genie for 3.5, because 3.5 math is much more complex and there are a ton of possible modifiers in play at any given moment. FUDGE is a much simpler mechanic (and more elegant, in my opinion) and since everything is based off a single roll, calculating is just easier to me. My interest in using MT to do the base calculations for FUDGE is simply to speed up the process. FUDGE combat is already much faster than 3.5 combat. And having a system to do the basic math just gives me more time to imagine the results and come up with a great and vivid description. :)

Thanks again Craig for your help. Having a way to run FUDGE with a single roll is fantastic. I look forward to unleashing all the new goodies on my guinea pigs tomorrow night! :D
"Neither hexes nor squares can confine me!"

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