OOC: General Discussion, Server Issues, etc.

[tygaran]

Ya know, I just realized something. I never leveled up Keelut when Amarok leveled. Oops

[Doopri]

Siddhartha continues to grow in power. Only this time something has... changed. Whether it is the nature of the quest at hand or the constant bombardment by fragments of his former lives, he has come to more perfectly reflect his divine nature. While still a being of the wood and one who wields the natural power of the elements, his near-divinity has surfaced as well. If recent revelations are correct, he will need the blessings of the divine to meet the threats aligning against the Blade.

Long winded way of saying I'll be taking Acolyte of the Divine Secrets - so I'm now a multiclass invoker! (Tyg when I get a look at Divine Power do you mind if I possibly swap this one out? The "Power" books have offered better multiclass feats and if there's another Invoker one I might want that one instead).

So for practical considerations - I'll now be trained in Religion. I can use the first level invoker power "Divine Bolts" once per encounter (and Tyg I get an additional +1 to damage on that power due to my Raging Storm lightning feat).

And for my two +1 to abilities - Wisdom and Con. That's all for now!

[imperialjunkie]

Good session last night. I'm surprised we survived the last fight.

Which brings up a suggestion I'd like to propose more formally. I think it would help the players a lot to be able to communicate more fluidly. I made a bonehead move last night that made the fight difficult, and if I had some input it might have been avoided. And we often run into issues where ranged and melee are positioned poorly. 4e requires a lot more teamwork than the previous version, and I think that people making choices about their turn in isolation from the plans and suggestions of others creates difficulties, and possibly tension. On the positive end, I think that we would have more fun using our respective PC's abilities if they were more in concert with the others. I would imagine that it's satisfying for a controller to have a situation presented where he could drop an area attack on 3 monsters, but it's hard to set that up without communication. If we had a faster way to discuss what we are doing-- even as simple as "I'm planning on shifting here" or "Could you get that monster to this spot"-- would be really helpful.

I have a ventrilo server that I already use during the game. Drekkan is on it, and he and I do a little of this, discussing what options we have to move. If all the players were on it, it would be very helpful. Typing whispers might be sufficient, but it is slow, and it lacks in that all the players can't give input at once. Really Tygaran doesn't even need to be on it if he doesn't want to. It would just be for players to discuss strategy.

I understand that voice communication can be awkward at first, but I think that we've all been playing together long enough to disarm some of that. When you start playing a game, it's natural that people work more isolated from the others. But we've developed a consistency and familiarity with one another that I think warrants taking the game to the next level in terms of teamwork and camaraderie.

What do you all think?

[Doopri]

I'm torn about the whole VOIP thing. Like you said, I like the idea of being able to do some OOC BSing. And it would make some of the tactical stuff easier to coordinate.

I also worry it'll take away from the RP. I've played in a few different settings with maptool, and hands-down the best RPing is done without voice. And I'm tempted to say that anything that could be coordinated over VOIP could be done completely in character (Henri with a "To the front Samuel!" Siddhartha intoning "Amarok it would be... wise... to leave that area"). And the other thing is that at times I like the unpredictable and the tactically unsound. Is Aristillus going to hang back and fire off searing bolts of light? Or is he going to rush forward in a fury to destroy that Tiefling who had the nerve to launch balefire at him? Same goes for tactical efficiency - I know with Siddhartha sometimes I do things that make NO sense tactically but that just seem to "fit" with his character. Running past three orc soldiers to heal Rain might not be my best tactical option for a turn but it just "feels" right with what he'd do in that situation.

Of course a lot of these situations can arise with or without voice and maybe they're not even directly going to come into play any more or less with it. And I know Tygaran is very forgiving when it comes to "bad moves" - he doesn't run a D&D chessmatch where once that token stops moving, that's it, you're there So we have time to get either in character or out of character "Um, you really DON'T want to go there" moments. Whereas with voice we may end up debating options for about 5 minutes of every characters' turn and then finally carrying it out.

So I'm not 100% sure about it. I have a couple other pros and cons in mind too, but these are some of my biggest worries - and the first two the main reasons why I'd want to do it. All that said, I'll gladly get on board either way. I'll probably even give it a shot next week just to see if I'm overreacting with how much I think it might make me neglect RP.

[imperialjunkie]

Good thoughts Doopri. You get to the heart of some things in this game (D&D) that have changed for me.

For my part, I don't think it would interfere with roleplaying. Mainly because I feel like a tool when I roleplay by voice, so I wouldn't do it. Playing online has really freed me to enjoy D&D to a greater degree, mainly because of roleplaying. I feel much more comfortable typing how I think Henri would respond to a situation rather than saying it by voice. So I wouldn't confuse the two in vent.

Your thoughts about tactical moves and RP are interesting. And it highlights something that has changed for me in 4e (mainly as a result of playing regularly in 4e, which I thank Tygaran for the opportunity to do ). Somehow this edition has enabled me to separate roleplaying and combat. I used to hate optimizing, and in 3.5 I would routinely make poor tactical choices or construct poor PCs from a combat perspective, because I wanted to RP what I imagined the person would fight like. But in 3.5, teamwork was less an issue, and my PC choices had less of a bearing on other players' choices than they do in 4e. In this edition, teamwork is vital, and is one of the principle things I like about it. I now don't really care what 'Henri' would do in combat. I care what a warlord (leader role) would do. I care more about making the best move so my fellow players can optimize their abilities. For instance based solely on RP, Henri would make stupid choices in combat because of his past, placing himself in harm's way to protect a teammate. I was doing that early on, and I realized that I was harming the team by taking way too much damage. My PC's job in combat is to lead (heal, buff, shift the battlefield); it is not to defend and soak up damage. If I were to roleplay him in combat, I wouldn't be helping you all play your characters-- because Henri would be routinely on the ground unconscious and unable to do my role. And also, by charging into the fray before Samuel, I would be getting in his way as a defender. So I tinkered with my build and took a reach weapon so I wouldn't be on the front lines as much. Now I feel more comfortable doing what I'm supposed to do as a leader. And that is help you guys.

I mentioned me trying to do Samuel's job by charging into battle like I did at first. Your example of Siddhartha making a risky move to heal is similar. When you take the time (standard action) to use the Heal skill on a PC that needs a saving throw or a use of second wind, you are functioning outside of your role and taking an action to do something that a leader is more equipped to do. First off, it takes the opportunity away from me, as the PC in the leader role, to use a power and shine (unless of course I'm out of heals, which requires communication for you to know). Secondly, and most importantly, it means that you as the controller aren't doing what you are equipped to do. Of course maybe you enjoy that more, which is the point of the game. But for me, I like to do the things that make me shine. I don't really enjoy doing a buttload of damage on Henri. That's Aristillus and Amorak's job. But I love it when a buff I have allows another player to do a buttload of damage. Usually it is Amorak, because he's melee (and also because he's in vent with me and it's easy to set up-- which is the reason I offered the suggestion of using vent ). I feel satisfied in my role in combat when I do those things.

So basically, when combat starts I almost completely focus on strategy and teamwork. I resume roleplaying when the dust has settled (except for maybe a comment here and there like "Excellent strike Samuel!"). This doesn't mean that I don't like roleplaying. I actually love it, and is the reason I enjoy D&D more than video games. What it does mean is that I go in and out of roleplaying mode, because combat and the game world are a little more divorced for me in this edition. And surprisingly I like it better that way.

Sorry for typing so much. Not meaning to be on a soapbox. This just gets to the heart of why I am really enjoying 4e so much. I love teamwork, but I also love roleplaying. This edition allows me to enjoy both aspects of the game, even if not at the same time.

[tygaran]

I'm fine with you guys discussing options in vent, just don't expect to see me there =]

I have no mic and no real intentions of getting one.

If you do discuss things that way, just let me know in the main MapTools chat. "(discussing)" would suffice to let me know why there'd be a delay.

[tygaran]

Well folks, as much as Rain wants to continue adventuring with Mr Sid, Mr Star and company, I think it's come time to phase out the DM-PC. We reliably have 5 real players now, so there is really no longer a need for an NPC in the Radiant Blade.

Like Shananna, Rain is already part of the overall campaign arc, so it's not like she'll be gone completely; just no longer with your group. I already know how to make her "exit stage left" as it were.

Which does leave the Radiant Blade without training in Thievery. How you end up dealing with that will be up to you guys. Options include Aris retraining a skill, Amarok's potential respect or char replacement, or someone taking the Skill Training (Thievery) feat.

[tygaran]

GM: The Radaint Blade are safe, and have recovered Elissa and Lena from the Shadowfell. They shall shortly be on their way to Greenheart in the Azure sky's airship, the Cobalt Wing....

As you are sort of between major incidents and heading to a place of safety, I'm sort of wondering what you guys might plan on doing?

Loose threads in the world include:
- What are the Orcs up to in southwestern Eldeen reaches?
- Where might Morac be now?
- What will the Alcomi do now that their Cannith weaponsforge has been destroyed?
- What is the true nature of all these Shards? And where/what is the 13th shard?

While Aris will likely talk to Elissa in private, any questions you have for Lena during the trip to Greenheart can be posed in the IC thread.

[Lethys]

Right now, Aris's priorities would be first Morac, and then the Alcomi. He would also be considering heading to Merylsward and the college, suspecting he would find more information there.

[Doopri]

Siddhartha also is going to be focused on Morac, based on the recent revelations about his possible hold on a shard (which is what Sid is REALLY interested in at this point - tracking down Morac just seems like the easiest way to get a bit more understanding about what Markella / The Cabinent / my nemesis are up to). I'll also likely want to track down the Gatekeeper to see if he's noticed any effects of the seal being closed. And what the heck, he's in Greenhart anyway

[imperialjunkie]

Henri would be mildly interested in dealing with Morac, for justice/vengeance sake. He would probably most be interested in Alcomi and the orc in the south. But overall, he now feels a great deal of allegiance to the Radiant Blade and will submit to the desires of the party. He's starting to feel like more than a mercenary.

[Doopri]

So I DIDN'T end up taking the ritual I thought I might take. And as a result I'm going to do a bit of RP time travel and we're all going to ERASE Sid taking some of Elissa's hair

That's just weird, and from now on, it never happened Ari can stop thinking I'm a freak now - well, he can continue thinking that, but if he does, it's not because of the hair thing - because it never happened!

On the plus side I did take a ritual that I think might be helpful for us once we get dumped out in the middle of nowhere

[tygaran]

There's been a request to upgrade our sessions from b50 to b56. As it seems to be rather stable, I don't see any reason to NOT do so. So please plan on using b56 for tomorrow's session, or let me know if you have a problem with b56. Thanks.

[imperialjunkie]

Was fun playing the new character, both rp and combat. It's fun being a blaster/burster, and a goody-two-shoes to boot.

[Doopri]

I'd like to keep the goodies (sword and statues).

Rightly or wrongly, I've grown attached to them and think they have some significance. And I can always turn them into residuum if I get sick of them

Of course if someone else really needs the money and is super close to getting that ritual / item / upgrade etc don't let me stand in the way.