The MacroPolicebox: Second Regeneration (D&D 4E Framework)

Framework(s) for D&D 4e, including Veggiesama's.

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wolph42
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Re: The MacroPolicebox: Rumble Edition (D&D 4E Framework)

Post by wolph42 »

Ah you have vids ff better! I'm gonna look at those. I dont play 4E myself but I'm always looking for new ideas to improve my own FW, as did Rumble :D

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AidyBaby
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Re: The MacroPolicebox: Rumble Edition (D&D 4E Framework)

Post by AidyBaby »

StarMan wrote:You and AidyBaby are heavy-hitters on this site so I would be very interested in your feedback. Thanks for your time!

I wouldn't describe myself as a big hitter on this site (I only made a few state icons!) but I do use Rumble's 'fat' framework exclusively, so far. Whilst I play D&D most weeks, my interaction with this forum has diminished considerably lately. I will, however, give your framework a proper trial and let you know my thoughts, in time.

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StarMan
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Re: The MacroPolicebox: Rumble Edition (D&D 4E Framework)

Post by StarMan »

You have over quintuple the posts that I do so relatively speaking that makes you "heavy" ... but in a good way! :wink:
AidyBaby wrote:I wouldn't describe myself as a big hitter on this site (I only made a few state icons!) but I do use Rumble's 'fat' framework exclusively, so far.


That's the beauty of it. You don't have to give up the setup portion of Rumble's and all your existing tokens made in that environment. In fact, Rumble usage is a requirement for setting up your tokens. Yeah, you can squeak by without it but even I found that kinda tough.

Think of the MPB as the union of two already powerful tools into one uber-hybrid extravaganza! Each framework complements the other in terms of strengthening weaknesses. You get the magnificent setup GUI of Rumble coupled with my gameplay feature set:

  • 3-D Support
  • Aura Support
  • Flank Detection
  • "Save Ends Both" support

and that's just for starters!!!! Again, if you try all my 5000 features at once you'll drive yourself crazy. Go through the Transition Guide on my site and then just try a few to start with. I'm not going anywhere so take your time.
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harassed
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Re: The MacroPolicebox: Rumble Edition (D&D 4E Framework)

Post by harassed »

I've spent the last few months getting to grips with the Rumble framework for my group and I've finally won them round (apart from the lag sometimes). MPB looks fantastic but I'd really love to see a demo if it in action before trying to introduce it to the group. Do you have any plans on releasing a video of MPB in action with a real-life session?

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Re: The MacroPolicebox: Rumble Edition (D&D 4E Framework)

Post by Longshot »

As for me, I want to find out how the NPC token is built for MPB, and create a direct importer. I say this with the caveat that I have about enough skill, but maybe no time ( run 3 games, have full-time school, and two part-time jobs). Still, I made time to learn the Rumble/Maptool code to fix/Tweak what I wanted to.

Anything to help jump-start this new endeavor would be appreciated.

**Edit**
Oh wait, found the section of info in the MPB documentation I was concerned with learning. Holy jeebus this thing is well documented...

I read about 80% of it prior to updating this post. Going over the harder stuff now.

In short, about this post...

Nevermind :)

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Re: The MacroPolicebox: Rumble Edition (D&D 4E Framework)

Post by fhscholl »

I spent a little time messing with this in the past 24 hours. So far, I'm pretty impressed. I like that you can build in token movement as part of a power. As a DM I also like that it shows me the rolls before acting on them so I can fudge if needed. It has been mentioned here already, but kudos on the documentation as many frameworks and libraries lack it completely.

A couple of (hopefully) quick questions. Is there any way to move multiple tokens as part of an action? I don't mean like Bull Rush. I mean I slide a target and each adjacent enemy or hit everyone in a close burst 1 and push them 1 square. If not, I completely understand why, just wondering.

Also, I didn't see (maybe I didn't look hard enough) if there was a way to apply something like the lasting effects of Beacon of Hope, where all healing done by the character is increased by 5 for the rest of the encounter.

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StarMan
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Re: The MacroPolicebox: Rumble Edition (D&D 4E Framework)

Post by StarMan »

harassed wrote:I've spent the last few months getting to grips with the Rumble framework for my group and I've finally won them round (apart from the lag sometimes). MPB looks fantastic but I'd really love to see a demo if it in action before trying to introduce it to the group. Do you have any plans on releasing a video of MPB in action with a real-life session?


I don't have any plans to do this as a typical round in our games lasts at least 10 minutes. Have you watched my first three videos here? I think they do a fairly good job of illustrating combat under this system. They were recorded in real-time without any editing tricks. It reaally is that easy to migrate from Rumble and start playing! Well, at least we think so anyway and hope it's as smooth for you.

As for the lag, that can happen for various reasons but especially with Rumble's fw due to its very large token size. I like to think the MPB lags less but it can still happen in certain situations. Try one encounter with your group and see how they like it. Then you can try more if that works out.
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StarMan
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Re: The MacroPolicebox: Rumble Edition (D&D 4E Framework)

Post by StarMan »

fhscholl wrote:A couple of (hopefully) quick questions. Is there any way to move multiple tokens as part of an action? I don't mean like Bull Rush. I mean I slide a target and each adjacent enemy or hit everyone in a close burst 1 and push them 1 square. If not, I completely understand why, just wondering.

Also, I didn't see (maybe I didn't look hard enough) if there was a way to apply something like the lasting effects of Beacon of Hope, where all healing done by the character is increased by 5 for the rest of the encounter.


Glad you're liking it! Moving a bunch of tokens at once is done with the "Mass Force Move" macro on the MPB itself. Unfortunately I don't think I documented this due to its complexity and questionable usefulness over doing it manually. Basically you use the "Take FM Snapshot" macro on the ABOS on each token you want to move and then run it. Let me know if you have trouble with this and I'll add more detail.

Sorry, you can't add a universal healing modifier so you gotta do it manually. Maybe I'll add this as a feature next version as it shouldn't be too hard.
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fhscholl
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Re: The MacroPolicebox: Rumble Edition (D&D 4E Framework)

Post by fhscholl »

Err... do recharge powers recharge? I see a Support Function macro named Recharge that seems like it does the trick, but I can't seem to find where it is called or where I would specify the recharge value.

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Re: The MacroPolicebox: Rumble Edition (D&D 4E Framework)

Post by StarMan »

Yup, that's all automatic as long as you configured the power that way in Rumble. During the conversion process the RACK will see that and add a "Recharge" macro line to the monster's "End My Turn" on its player token. During actual game play, the DM will see a "Power X is available." if the d6 was favourable or "... failed to recharge." if it was not.

Again, the most important point is remembering to configure the Rumble power properly. Click on the link in the upper left corner of his "Edit Power" dialog and enter the lowest number for the recharge. For example, the Villain's "Stunning Maul" is configured as "5, 6". The "6" is unnecessary (i.e. Entering "5" here is sufficient) but that's OK as it is ignored by the RACK. If you look at time index 2:05 of my Combat Demo video you will see this indeed recharged.

If you're still having trouble, attach your campaign file to a post along with the exact set of steps you are following.
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Re: The MacroPolicebox: Rumble Edition (D&D 4E Framework)

Post by StarMan »

Longshot wrote:As for me, I want to find out how the NPC token is built for MPB, and create a direct importer. I say this with the caveat that I have about enough skill, but maybe no time ( run 3 games, have full-time school, and two part-time jobs). Still, I made time to learn the Rumble/Maptool code to fix/Tweak what I wanted to.


Again LS, as per my last post on the subject your enthusiasm for this project gladdens the heart! :) If you think you can write something that will allow MPB users to paste in a bit of Compendium text and write a macro on their library token then you have my unequivocal support. I will give you whatever assistance I can in making that happen although I must admit that if I had your workload I would think twice. For now, my group and I are happy using the RACK as it suits our needs.

As for tweaking Rumble's code, speaking for myself I can think of better things to do than sifting through his 5 billion lines of code. Now that he has thrown in the towel the idea has even less appeal. It was bad enough deciphering his "Powers" property to write the RACK so I am now taking a well-earned break from that aspect of development.
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Re: The MacroPolicebox: Rumble Edition (D&D 4E Framework)

Post by fhscholl »

StarMan wrote:During the conversion process the RACK will see that and add a "Recharge" macro line to the monster's "End My Turn" on its player token. During actual game play, the DM will see a "Power X is available." if the d6 was favourable or "... failed to recharge." if it was not.


Ahh, yes. I see it now. It did convert over properly. I was looking for it at the start of turn instead of the end.

I get that your primary focus here is converting from Rumble tokens, but I'm with LS. I would love to see the middle man cut out here and the ability to initialize a blank token and build it from there or import via the compendium. I ask a lot of questions around how things work because if/when I need to make changes to a token, I prefer to maintain it in one place. I have a programming background so updating the macros isn't an issue for me. In some ways I actually prefer it. That being said, one of the criticisms you will get is that there is no pretty way to edit powers after the fact, but with the way you create and store them today, a pretty editor just isn't an option.

Overall, this is certainly my favorite 4E framework of the ones I have used because of the good documentation and it doesn't try to over-complicate simple tasks.

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Re: The MacroPolicebox: Rumble Edition (D&D 4E Framework)

Post by StarMan »

Don't worry FH, I can assure you and LS that we are all on the same page direction-wise. Yes, I like maintaining in one place too but figured riding Rumble's coattails would be easier than building my own importer and token editor from scratch. Why reinvent the wheel? The reason I focused so much time and energy into the RACK is because I figured nobody would look twice at the MPB unless they had a clear and simple migration path from the reigning king of the heap. That doesn't mean it has to be the only migration path.

I just feel guilty about you guys doing more work than you need to when JamesManhattan has already gotten us halfway there. Again, I haven't had time to look over this thread in too much detail. Have either of you tried converting a DND4E file as he suggests? Would this be helpful in writing the new importer? Can we use this for monsters too or is it just for PCs? I would be interested in your thoughts on the matter.

I would do it myself except right now I'm working on entering the monsters for P2 into Rumble so I can RACK them later. GROAN, this is slow, hard work! :( If you guys can come through on making this whole process easier then I and all our MPB brethren would be eternally grateful! :mrgreen:
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Re: The MacroPolicebox: Rumble Edition (D&D 4E Framework)

Post by Longshot »

So, update on my progress to get Direct NPC imports.

I learned the basics of JM's importer code, and how Rumble adapted it. Then saw how the RACK code begins the conversion process. I would start by using the existing import coding if it weren't for the fact that I am going to approach this from a different direction. Rather than Select All on the DDI monster page, I would rather right-click on the stat webpage, View page source, and select all that.

Why?

Because then the parser can see what the user can see on the page. It can see the symbols for ranged, melee, burst, each recharge dice, even bold and background colors, all via the HTML code. And despite varieties in input, the HTML formatting for this is fairly constant, as far as I am aware. The real trick here is the powers (and I guess Auras) naturally. I'm fairly certain I could do everything but that easily (maybe not quickly, but it's not hard).

My next trick to to figure out how the powers are coded in MPB. Fortunately, there is a lot of documentation to start off with.

Wish me luck.

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Re: The MacroPolicebox: Rumble Edition (D&D 4E Framework)

Post by StarMan »

Oooo, I see where you're going with that! I don't have access to DDI right now to view its source. However, if I'm understanding correctly you are suggesting using the HTML coding itself as field delimiters so you can parse out the relevant data, right? Brilliant!!!!

If you have looked at my "Setup Player Token" macro you will see I kinda use the same method on Rumble's raw jmh.StatCard. That code is shakier because it relies on indexing the variable because there are no delimiters to speak of. Yeah, it ain't pretty but it works with regard to pulling out the save mod and sight type.

Speaking of "not pretty", you have also probably recoiled in horror at the hulking monstrosity that is the RACK itself. This is the ugliest piece of coding in the whole framework but I am at a loss on how to make it more efficient. {shrug} It works and that's the most important thing.

Thanks for the update and let me know if you have trouble with the Programmer's Reference (thereby obviating the need for "tricks" and "luck", as you say). :wink: I would have liked to have gone into more detail but once again I have bigger fish to fry these days.
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