The MacroPolicebox: Second Regeneration (D&D 4E Framework)

Framework(s) for D&D 4e, including Veggiesama's.

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StarMan
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Re: The MacroPolicebox: Rumble Edition (D&D 4E Framework)

Post by StarMan »

ronsson wrote:I didn't have time to look at your framework before this weekends play session but will do asap. That .dnd4e importer seems really promising since importing raw data should be the way to go!


As explained above, you should just watch the videos and read the docs for now. Things are looking very promising for 2.0's release next month. One correction is that I don't have a .dnd4e importer although that is a great idea. For the time being, I only support copy/paste from the Compendium and PDFs.

I started looking at the structure of app-based dnd4e files a few days ago and it seems to contain the necessary data to construct powers. After a little more research into whether the new online CB can generate the same data, I'll be able to determine if this is feasible or not.
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ronsson
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Re: The MacroPolicebox: Rumble Edition (D&D 4E Framework)

Post by ronsson »

Yup really looking forward to 2.0. Watched the videos - looks really promising!

Meanwhile, I'm trying to sort out the situation with importing powers and weapons and whatevers.

I print pdfs from DDI using cutepdf which I found recommended somewhere. I can't select any text from the output pdf. Is it possible that Wizards made the character sheets print out as pure images instead of mixed with text fields just to botch operations like these? I get nothing to paste..

I've found the creature rptok library as google docs which is superb so thanks for that everyone involved!

I am also wondering about two things someone might be able to direct me to:
1. Since I've barely got this going yet, I am very confused as to what sort of inventory management there is if any in these frameworks?
2. Are there any premade item/power/other useful libraries available just as token imports? If not - why?

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StarMan
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Re: The MacroPolicebox: Rumble Edition (D&D 4E Framework)

Post by StarMan »

ronsson wrote:I print pdfs from DDI using cutepdf which I found recommended somewhere. I can't select any text from the output pdf. Is it possible that Wizards made the character sheets print out as pure images instead of mixed with text fields just to botch operations like these? I get nothing to paste..


Confirmed, this happens to me too. This has been discussed in other threads and it is generally agreed this is WotC's attempt to foil nerfing of their intellectual property. Counter-arguments include the fact we have paid for the subscription so we should be allowed to download the data for our own personal use. Naturally I favor this latter line of reasoning. :wink:

No I have not included any inventory management as this functionality is handled admirably by Character Builder. You may want to ask Kyuss11 for his solution in this regard but he has written it for Rumble.
Aside from Kryx's collection which you appear to have found, I don't know of any other central repository containing imported data. Trust me, the support for importing weapons, magic items, etc will be worth waiting a few more weeks for. For example, you will be able to import an ordinary longsword and then import the "Thundering Weapon" entry from the Compendium. The MPB will respond by generating the appropriate power macro for the weapon and give the message: "Upgraded Longsword to Thundering Longsword +2.".

Sorry, although I have dozens of MPB powers and magic items written, I can't give them to you. Rumble has made numerous posts itemizing the potential legal quagmires associated with this practice. I personally doubt WotC will raise a fuss but you never can be too careful. Again, 2.0 will make importing these stupidly simple so I wouldn't worry too much.
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Jagged
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Re: The MacroPolicebox: Rumble Edition (D&D 4E Framework)

Post by Jagged »

ronsson wrote: I can't select any text from the output pdf. Is it possible that Wizards made the character sheets print out as pure images instead of mixed with text fields just to botch operations like these?

That is exactly what they've done.

If I know I have to import a specific power with a lot of text, I hop over to the Compendium Tool and search the power. The Compendium Tool returns pure text (or rather html).

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MPB:SR now online!

Post by StarMan »

jfrazierjr wrote:1) yeah for the new release!!!


ronsson wrote:Yup really looking forward to 2.0. Watched the videos - looks really promising!


... and I'm looking forward to Joomla fixing their mass mailing system! :x I don't think anybody got my release notice a couple of days ago (please post here if you did) so I am posting here and hoping my users are tracking this discussion:

StarMan wrote:Happy Halloween, fellow MPBers!

Yes, it has been a long time since we rock-and-rolled. That's a Zeppelin reference for those who missed it. :wink: That's because I have been quietly toiling away on the new MPB version. It has taken tremendous amounts of blood, sweat and tears but the day has come. We can now remove all the wheelbocks and head down the runway!!!

Several months ago, the residents of Scarborough (city in Ontario, Canada where I live) and outlying regions in the Greater Toronto Area heard a resounding "CLUNK!!!". In the area and wondering what that was? Well, that was Rumble's Framework hitting the bottom of my trashcan! ;o) That's right, my friends. Rumble is now 100% IRRELEVANT for the purpose of importing PCs, monsters and their powers into the MPB!!! OK his campaign properties infrastructure is still very evident and 3 of his internal data representations are still used but these aren't things you as a user needs to worry about.

Don't get me wrong, I think Rumble's effort was brilliant … for its time. His importing features helped a little bit but unfortunately just didn't go far enough. An enormous amount of manual configuration was still required before (didn't you just LOVE answering all those questions like whether the source was from a PDF and if there was a "Trigger" line?) and after the fact (i.e. Leader powers couldn't be imported and it couldn't detect beneficial states like attack bonuses and healing). Furthermore, if you wanted to import material from an adventure then you were pretty much outta luck.

Most importantly, a few of you commented that you weren't amused Rumble token creation and migration to the MPB was mandatory. I see where you were coming from but I stand by my assertion that Rumble had the best interface of all the frameworks and I take my hat off to him for that. I still think using his excellent work as my data entry vehicle was the wisest course at the time. Sure you can still do things in Rumble first if you want. However, when you see the new Second Regeneration importing suite your city's citizens will be knocking on YOUR door to ask what the "CLUNK!!!" was! LOL

Please watch the brand new videos on my site and download the new version. As many of you know, I rarely write these bulletin notices so please continue to watch the site as I update the documentation with new material over the next little while. I look forward to getting your feedback on the RPTools forum thread. Replies to all e-mails will be answered there so you might as well post your questions there to begin with. Happy gaming to you …
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Re: The MacroPolicebox: Rumble Edition (D&D 4E Framework)

Post by irfus »

Is the PC import supported only through the online CB generated files or will dnd4e files created by the offline builder work too? If not, is there a pdf import still supported? Sorry if this has been answered already in one of the videos, am still going through them. :)

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Re: The MacroPolicebox: Rumble Edition (D&D 4E Framework)

Post by StarMan »

No. I tried an app-based CB file and it only imported the stats ... which is fine if you want to continue by manually pasting in the power descriptions from the Compendium, PDFs or whatever. The problem is the offline one doesn't include the power details, just the titles. I'm not going to worry about supporting it as I don't know how many people use it any more.
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AidyBaby
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Re: The MacroPolicebox: Rumble Edition (D&D 4E Framework)

Post by AidyBaby »

Hi, I got your email! I have been looking forward to this update.

I haven't had much time to test but I did try and import my player's PCs but run into errors each time that I couldn't get around. They are 16th level with a fair collection of powers. I've edited the the powers text box to ensure the # marks are at the correct place but still couldn't get it to work. I dunno if this helps but it SEEMS to fall over with Heroic Effort.

Do you want me to post the XML for one of the characters?

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Re: The MacroPolicebox: Rumble Edition (D&D 4E Framework)

Post by StarMan »

AidyBaby wrote:Hi, I got your email!


Really? Weird, but thanks for confirming. Maybe it's my ISP's spam filter.

AidyBaby wrote:Do you want me to post the XML for one of the characters?


Yes, please. As per my post above, you're exporting from the online CB, right? Actually, one of the characters I tested had that feat and it worked. What happens when you try importing manually from the Compendium? Just make sure your Notes tab is empty and run "FL->Import PC Power". In either case please send me the chat log text.
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Re: The MacroPolicebox: Rumble Edition (D&D 4E Framework)

Post by AidyBaby »

OK - still no joy. Yes, PC is from the online builder.

Kasperan.txt
(288.76 KiB) Downloaded 49 times

When I 'OK' the Heroic Effort power (which seems to be the first power imported) I get a condition add-on dialog set for a +2 attack bonus. Actually, not sure how your framework will handle this power as it offers a +4 bonus retrospectively to a failed attack or save. Putting that aside for now though the dialog is:

dialog.PNG
dialog.PNG (5.17 KiB) Viewed 1183 times

No matter how I edit this dialog or if I leave it as-is, it fails with the following message:

Code: Select all

Lib:MacroPolicebox:
 Default macro buttons generated and player token configured. If necessary, run "Frankenstein's Lab" power creation macro.
    Invalid condition in IF(!MacroID && !startsWith(command, "[") && command!="") roll option.       Statement options (if any): IF(!MacroID && !startsWith(command, "[") && command!=""), CODE       Statement Body : { [ConditionNotes=setStrProp(ConditionNotes, "Initiative", "Combat [email protected]"+LibToken)] [createMacro("Combat Prep", decode(command), macroProps)] }


If I clear the notes tab (which i've done on both PC and Lib token) and try to import the power individually I get the same result. This is as far as I've got so I can't comment or the remainder of the import. It's possible I'm doing something wrong - I have watched your new vids though.

I'm not totally convinced the Heroic Effort power is the cause directly, I have been trying to import a dwarf without this power and had similar issues.

I'm keen to move over to your framework, so any feedback I can offer is done gladly.

-- AidyBaby --

EDIT

The dwarf fails directly after trying to import Dwarven Resilience. Anything to do with the fact these are racial features?

Code: Select all

   Invalid condition in IF(!MacroID && !startsWith(command, "[") && command!="") roll option.       Statement options (if any): IF(!MacroID && !startsWith(command, "[") && command!=""), CODE       Statement Body : { [ConditionNotes=setStrProp(ConditionNotes, "Initiative", "Combat [email protected]"+LibToken)] [createMacro("Combat Prep", decode(command), macroProps)] }
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StarMan
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Re: The MacroPolicebox: Rumble Edition (D&D 4E Framework)

Post by StarMan »

Excellent problem description, AB!!! If only other users who say the oh-so-helpful "It doesn't work" could be as forthcoming.

AidyBaby wrote:When I 'OK' the Heroic Effort power (which seems to be the first power imported) I get a condition add-on dialog set for a +2 attack bonus. Actually, not sure how your framework will handle this power as it offers a +4 bonus retrospectively to a failed attack or save.


That is a bug as is the broken IF statement you posted. The first was insidious and the latter even more insidious. These are too show-stopping to leave for v2.1 so please download again and retry. Remember the Golden Rule of importing: Check every field and if it screwed up anywhere then just correct. I particularly don't like how often it shrugs at the amount of hit points healed so I'll be taking a closer look at this soon.

Do you know how to code? If so, then try out this version of "Inspiring Word" that I wrote:

Code: Select all

[MACRO("[email protected]:MacroPolicebox"): "Power="+getMacroName()+"; FlavorText=You call out to a wounded ally and offer inspiring words of courage and determination that helps that ally heal.; PowerSpecs=encounter   &diams   Martial, Healing<br>minor,  Close burst 10; Attack=Feature; Type="+Class+" Feature 1"]

[
MACRO("Choose [email protected]:MacroPolicebox"): "IncludeSelf=1; Range=10; Single=1; Select=Allies"]
[
h:varsFromStrProp(macro.return)]
[
MACRO("Send [email protected]:MacroPolicebox"): "[email protected]:MacroPolicebox; Targets="+Targets]
[
MACRO("Register [email protected]:MacroPolicebox"): "Name=Healing from Inspiring Word; Property=CurrHP; Mod=0-"+(floor((Level-1)/5)+1)+"d6-Cha; Duration=Perm; Token="+Targets


The "(floor((Level-1)/5)+1)" should work for most leader healing minors.
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Re: The MacroPolicebox: Rumble Edition (D&D 4E Framework)

Post by AidyBaby »

Haven't got time to spend playing with the update at the moment but just thought I'd let you know that the mod has worked. I can now fully import the PC I tried. Yay!

Once I get a little time to play with it I'll let you know how it's going.

AidyBaby
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Re: The MacroPolicebox: Second Regeneration (D&D 4E Framewor

Post by Epiktetus »

Just started trying to learn MPB, and I'm honestly on the fence between this and Rumble's. Rumble's is really limited, but then again it only took me about an hour to figure out, then a few hours to put in my player's tokens and couple more to build an encounter, plus it's already done. Right now it seems like MPB will be more like a few weeks to learn, but then importing and building will be dramatically decreased. It's all about pay now or pay later, huh?

One thing that Rumble's has over the MPB hands down is the learning curve. There's one PDF that covers nearly everything you need to know, while MPB has some documentation that seems a little out of date in a difficult to follow format with "next" and "prev" buttons that work more like "random article" buttons (a Joomla issue I'm betting), plus some pretty well done videos that seem to assume that you already have some experience with the framework, and leave a lot of holes.

I discovered MPB only hours before my last player session (too late to get it up and running) and this week we're off for Thanksgiving, so I've got two full weeks to get it figured out, but it's been a challenge to say the least. 5 level 18 characters aren't quick to import even with the best tools, but mostly it's trying to figure out what's going on as a whole.

I'm normally the kind of guy that exhausts every resource before posting, but there's so much to go through... so here's my first question: After doing a test import of one of my characters I found a pile of tokens. Many of them named after powers. What should my players do with this pile? Are the extra tokens effectively just more lib tokens or do they need to use them for targeting? I haven't seen any reference in the docs and videos that I've see so far.

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Re: The MacroPolicebox: Second Regeneration (D&D 4E Framewor

Post by StarMan »

Good feedback, thanks! Wow, you're jumping in at the deep end just like Aidy Baby ... only he seems to have had an easier time. If you have gone through my videos you will see I purposely started with first level characters and monsters. You will drive yourself crazy if you try to learn everything at once. The reason Rumble is simple is because he has maybe (maybe!) 10% of my feature set. A tiny 15 page PDF won't cut it for describing all the things the MPB can do. In the first paragraph of my home page I explain the docs are under revision for the new features but all except the Programmer's Reference is up to date. I might need to add more details but you will need to let me know what you're fuzzy on as most people are able to follow it quite well.

Epiktetus wrote:... a difficult to follow format with "next" and "prev" buttons that work more like "random article" buttons (a Joomla issue I'm betting)


Bingo. Hopefully Joomla will fix that bug but in the meantime don't use those buttons. Click on the menu links to the left. As for all those power tokens, the second paragraph here explains they are spell tokens. You will see one of these (called Frostburn) in the lich videos. Just store them off to the side of your map and they will be called to the ABOS position by your character when you cast them. If they have powers, click on its "FL->Import PC Power" and then Cancel. This will allow you to define a power manually.

You might want to create a simple level 1 party and a few low-level monsters just to experiment first. You can then ease into the more complicated stuff later if you wish. Either way, make sure everybody watches the v1.x videos at the bottom of that page (#3 onward) as they do a good job of explaining how all your buttons work.

If you still want to make a go of your high level party first, be more specific in what you want help with. Did all the powers on your one test character get generated successfully from the XML? What happened when you tried attacking the skeleton warriors in the Demo camapaign? Did you try creating any monsters? Which ones and from where? What happens when you attack them?
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Re: The MacroPolicebox: Second Regeneration (D&D 4E Framewor

Post by Vhex »

Epiktetus wrote:One thing that Rumble's has over the MPB hands down is the learning curve


StarMan's philosophy and Rumble's philosophy are different in that aspect. Rumble was going for form over function, whereas StarMan is going for function over form. This gives Rumble's framework a more intuitive feel, which is why the learning curve is a lot less. StarMan's assumption of the users that will be using his framework are that they have experience coding or will be getting experience with macro coding. You don't have to have that to run his framework, but it helps quite a bit. That's also why the videos seem to have gaps in them.

StarMan is also going for optimization in low bandwidth/memory scenarios which is why you end up with all of the lib tokens. If you're playing a local game, it does make it confusing. But if you're playing a game over the internet, then his framework will run faster than Rumble's.

There's also the benefit that StarMan's framework is being actively developed, whereas Rumble's is not. However, with 4e sunsetting, how much of a benefit that is depends on how much simulation you're looking for.

Even though it feels like a waste of time when you're trying to get a game going, I would suggest doing as StarMan suggests -- start with low level characters to learn a bit more about the framework. This will tell you what your comfort level is with his framework and will let you know if you want to go further down the learning path. It will also cut down on the learning curve to start so you can see if his framework is for you. He does have a pretty advanced featureset, but if your game doesn't really need all that then you might be more comfortable with a framework that is more geared to the user interface. It's all personal preference and how much of the game you want the framework to handle. There's no wrong answer.

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