D&D 4E character sheets and rules primer released

emirikol · Post by **emirikol** » Sun Mar 02, 2008 11:24 am

I see the rules and character sheets for 4E were released from the D&D Experience along with a bunch of monster stats and some of the rules.

It looks like the game streamlined some things and made it "epic" from 1st level forwards as they've added another level of "abilities" on top of FEATs and SKILLS. I'm not totally sure yet, but it looks it will be a lot more brain-crushing calculations from round to round from the DM standpoint.

Here is the 4E rules primer: http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dn ... /20080228a

4E COMBAT rules: http://www.enworld.org/showpost.php?p=4 ... ostcount=1 [edit]

Here are the pregenerated characters: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/files/Experi ... acters.zip

The WARLORD: http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/drdd/20080314 [edit]

The classes detailed are:
Fighter, Wizard, Cleric (unaligned), Warlock, Ranger, paladin

a 4E character is the eqivalent to a 5th or 6th level 3E character IMO. Since their goal was to reach the sweet spot right away, I think they accomplished that..of course..where do you go from there?

Thoughts?

jh

Full Bleed · Post by **Full Bleed** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 1:18 pm

Hmmm... I was quietly looking forward to 4th (especially the online/digital integration)... but after reading this I'm getting a lot less interested. It doesn't feel "stream-lined" at all (at least not in the ways that I was hoping.)

It looks like there are more things for a DM to have to track like healing surges, powers, and action points/milestones. Rounds now have 4 types of actions: standard, move, minor, and free. Players are encouraged to use "powers" instead of "basic attacks" (and powers are just a whole other layer of "feats" by another name.)

And there are too many mechanics that are like computer games/mmos:

1) Characters completely heal after a 6 hour rest period. That coupled with healing surges makes characters seem like the super-human regeneration machines (which, in MMO's, they are.)
2) Not only do characters have classes, but they are pigeonholed even more by making each class part of a "role."
3) "At-Will" powers can be used once an "encounter." A 5 minute short "rest" regenerates those powers. This is such an artificial construct, which is ideal for computer gaming when being in an encounter and out of one is always very clearly defined.

Not impressed.

About the only mechanic that I initially thought was kind of cool was the concept of static defenses (with Fort, Will, and Reflex becoming a kind of AC.) That seemed to fall in line with their so-called streamlining propaganda.

emirikol · Post by **emirikol** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 1:58 pm

I took some of the Kids from the WotC boards and ran them using the Pregen 4E characters and the quick-start rules. It actually ran very smooth and was fun, but the DM has to be a fricking encyclopedia though or have the whole stat right in front of him at all times. I ran the Kobold and they have THREE special powers that you have to keep track of. THREE! FOR A KOBOLD! This is where Maptools will need to help me out I'm thinking.

I'll be switching..just so I have enough players for the group..but I'm going to have to get on a briain-grow program and really PIMP Maptools to help me out.

jh

Hawke · Post by **Hawke** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 2:20 pm

Overall, I'm really excited about everything they're doing. I get the sense that as a DM I'll have a much easier time - I'm currently running a SW SAGA and the changes there are all great in doing that. The varying monster roles and the mob-based rather than single-baddie stuff are all very exciting. I love the powers/talent systems and the simplification of skills.

The states and special combat actions all seem more straight forward.

We're debating at scheduling our next milestones in my current Dark Sun campaign before switching over. It'll be a little tougher... maybe I'll do some quick crawls to "re-level" their characters so they get used to the new system before jumping up a bunch of levels.

Is it June yet?

Oh and for the record I'm not interested in DD:I

torstan · Post by **torstan** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 7:23 pm

Quietly intrigued, but a little less sold after the D&D Experience.

It was the interview with the guy from Paizo that did it - have a read over on enworld.org of you haven't seen it already. It's sobering reading from an industry professional who knows what he's talking about. However keep in mind he is pissed off that the OGL for 4th Ed didn't arrive on time....

Nevertheless I shall definitely be checking out 4E when it comes out.... and have no interest in DDI

Mortani · Post by **Mortani** » Tue Mar 04, 2008 5:28 pm

Didn't Paizo lose Dungeon and Dragon magazine as well?

emirikol · Post by **emirikol** » Tue Mar 04, 2008 5:39 pm

Correct. WotC wanted complete control with Dungeon /Dragon for their DDI (otherwise, what would they have to offer?).

It's a shame, becasue Paizo did an excellent job. Most of us Dungeon enthusiasts were very disappointed..but it's business.

Jay

snikle · Post by **snikle** » Fri Mar 07, 2008 6:29 pm

emirikol wrote:a 4E character is the eqivalent to a 5th or 6th level 3E character IMO.

LOL Wow, power gamers unite!

FdL · Post by **FdL** » Fri Mar 07, 2008 10:01 pm

This was a very interesting material.

Anyone knows what "bloodied" means?

Hawke · Post by **Hawke** » Fri Mar 07, 2008 10:27 pm

It's basically a hybrid between the current D&D system and the Star Wars saga edition "condition track." Once you get to half hitpoints, you start seeing negative effects to your character. I'm unclear what those exactly are in 4E, but in SAGA it amounts to negatives on your dice rolls. It's a way of simulating that if you get beaten up/worn down you wont perform as well as when you're tip top.

I think in 4E they weren't going to have negatives to rolls but instead of a whole score of abilities that either 1) you can only use while bloodied (think Hulk!) or 2) you can use against bloodied enemies (or to help bloodied allies)

FdL · Post by **FdL** » Sat Mar 08, 2008 8:18 am

Thanks! I see the tiefling has an ability that takes advantage of this. It's an interesting mechanic, though a change that can have real impact on strategies. In any case, I never liked the idea that an enemy performs the same in combat with 100 HP than with 1 HP.

Post by **dorpond** » Sat Mar 08, 2008 8:19 am

Wow, great stuff!
I am really looking orward to this now! Lots of cool abilities. I like the exra action they have now - allows for far more realistic options during game.

What we really need in MT now before D&D4 is released - diagonal movement option settings. I will still be playing 3.5 and probably some 4.0 games - need to get movement counting correct for each.

Emryys · Post by **Emryys** » Sun Mar 09, 2008 5:46 am

FdL wrote:Anyone knows what "bloodied" means?

It's how you feel after WOTC takes your money...

carpens · Post by **carpens** » Sun Mar 09, 2008 7:56 am

Emryys wrote:
FdL wrote:Anyone knows what "bloodied" means?
It's how you feel after WOTC takes your money...

More specifically, it's the weakened state you're in after spending $100 to replace your core rulebooks- again. WotC has an ability that lets them take advantage of this state. If successful, they convince you to spend another $10/month for additional fluff that you probably don't actually need or want.

Dark Thoughts · Post by **Dark Thoughts** » Sun Mar 09, 2008 1:01 pm

Emryys wrote:
FdL wrote:Anyone knows what "bloodied" means?
It's how you feel after WOTC takes your money...

Hahaha

I was looking through my 3.0/3.5 D20 System books awhile ago to determine what I wanted to sell on Ebay. I found several that I wouldn't mind getting rid of, but after checking their sales on Ebay, I decided it wasn't worth the time to list them.

As far as 4E goes, I'm not too excited about it. I think it will have a couple of things that our group can use, but making a complete switch probably won't happen. Our campaign is currently a mix of 3.0 and 3.5 and that works fine.

RPTools.net

D&D 4E character sheets and rules primer released

D&D 4E character sheets and rules primer released

Re: D&D 4E character sheets and rules primer released